Mad with Jiffy Lube

[Kaze]

I'm mad with jiffy lube this week. I paid them $80 a couple weeks ago to flush out my radiator and refill the whole coolant system ('cause i got a low coolant light before i took it to them, plus my antifreeze is factor from 2000). Now, the other night the light came on again and i had to run it back to campus carefully (My school is an hr away from home, so i stay on campus) and I'm going to have to travel 1 hr home to go yell at these guys to review their work.

Just to make sure its them and not the car, I went to look at it last night after it cooled down, and the reservoir looks right, there were no leaks around any of the pipes, and everything looked clean. I was told to look under the radiator cap to make sure the fluid level is okay, but ford puts this metal cover that runs on top of the radiator across the whole front end, and its bolted to the frame and each fender. So I couldn't look under ,or even find, the radiator cap to check the fluid level there. Me and my friends are starting to think its a pressurization issue, or an air bubble at the sensor.

I drove it around again last night and it came on once, but only after driving/idling for about 3 hours. Even then shutting off the car and restarting it made the light go away. Idk if thats odd behavior either. The Temp Gauge's all stayed normal too as I did some highway driving to check and see if anything changed. It was really warm, but then again after 3 hours of highway, city, and idling, any car would be, the gauges remained normal.

Idk, you guys think jiffy lube is behind this one, or is my engine just about ready to crap out?

The Car is a 2001 Mercury Sable LS, 3.0L Duratec 24V V6 (the Sables have an incomplete VVT system, only puts out around 200hp and 201 ft-lbs according to ford)

[Action B]

Originally Posted by Kaze

I'm mad with jiffy lube this week. I paid them $80 a couple weeks ago to flush out my radiator and refill the whole coolant system ('cause i got a low coolant light before i took it to them, plus my antifreeze is factor from 2000). Now, the other night the light came on again and i had to run it back to campus carefully (My school is an hr away from home, so i stay on campus) and I'm going to have to travel 1 hr home to go yell at these guys to review their work.

Just to make sure its them and not the car, I went to look at it last night after it cooled down, and the reservoir looks right, there were no leaks around any of the pipes, and everything looked clean. I was told to look under the radiator cap to make sure the fluid level is okay, but ford puts this metal cover that runs on top of the radiator across the whole front end, and its bolted to the frame and each fender. So I couldn't look under ,or even find, the radiator cap to check the fluid level there. Me and my friends are starting to think its a pressurization issue, or an air bubble at the sensor.

I drove it around again last night and it came on once, but only after driving/idling for about 3 hours. Even then shutting off the car and restarting it made the light go away. Idk if thats odd behavior either. The Temp Gauge's all stayed normal too as I did some highway driving to check and see if anything changed. It was really warm, but then again after 3 hours of highway, city, and idling, any car would be, the gauges remained normal.

Idk, you guys think jiffy lube is behind this one, or is my engine just about ready to crap out?

The Car is a 2001 Mercury Sable LS, 3.0L Duratec 24V V6 (the Sables have an incomplete VVT system, only puts out around 200hp and 201 ft-lbs according to ford)

This isn't necessarily their fault. Though, I would say that they kinda suckered you into the coolant flush maybe. That probably wasn't really necessary.

[Kaze]

I figure, factory coolant, car was manufactured in 2000 more than likely, if the coolant was in the car then, then the coolant is 10 years old almost, but even if not, and the dealership put it in when we bought it, then its still 8 years old.

Honestly I think they're the ones required to jump in and resolve any of the issues, especially if theres an air bubble or a pressurization issue. That means the mechanic there messed up, or they have equipment failure with the machine that does the flush.

[jimmythekid1]

Ford are notorious for the coolant level sensors failing that live in the jug. That system is completely closed the only cap it has is on the jug.

Jiffy lube is not a certified repair shop shop, they just have minimum wage employees that are not fully train to diagnosis vehicle problems. They are just do easy maintenance like fluid flushes and filters.

Sound like you diagnoised the problem then took it to them and told them what to do. So how is that thier fault?

[ling427ttvette]

Replace the sensor, get on with your life. It is NOT Jiffy Lube's fault.

It was people that did things like this I hated when I worked on cars for a living. I'd replace the brake pads, and then a headlight would go out.. but it was my fault because I was the last one to work on it.

You told them the coolant light was on, thinking you had low coolant. Instead of you just re-filling it, or even checking the coolant level for yourself, you let them sucker you into flushing it. Sure, it's good for it.. but it wasn't necessary. Coolant doesn't necessarily break down and quit working like oil does.

I will bet $100 it's a faulty sensor.

[Kaze]

Originally Posted by jimmythekid1

Ford are notorious for the coolant level sensors failing that live in the jug. That system is completely closed the only cap it has is on the jug.

Jiffy lube is not a certified repair shop shop, they just have minimum wage employees that are not fully train to diagnosis vehicle problems. They are just do easy maintenance like fluid flushes and filters.

Sound like you diagnoised the problem then took it to them and told them what to do. So how is that thier fault?

Originally Posted by ling427ttvette

Replace the sensor, get on with your life. It is NOT Jiffy Lube's fault.

It was people that did things like this I hated when I worked on cars for a living. I'd replace the brake pads, and then a headlight would go out.. but it was my fault because I was the last one to work on it.

You told them the coolant light was on, thinking you had low coolant. Instead of you just re-filling it, or even checking the coolant level for yourself, you let them sucker you into flushing it. Sure, it's good for it.. but it wasn't necessary. Coolant doesn't necessarily break down and quit working like oil does.

I will bet $100 it's a faulty sensor.

my bad guys, I'm sorry for this misunderstanding. Jimmy thanks for letting me know about the cap in the reservoir being the only cap, I was worried i'd have to remove more to find a radiator cap (cause that cover is right over the radiator).

The issue I have isn't that I diagnosed the problem then took it to em, its like ling basically said I had a low coolant light, and was instructed by my dad to just do the flush. The guy there was just gonna top it off for me you know? But I told em do the flush, the guy was even surprised i wanted it, I understand what you guys are saying about how "I told em what to do and they do it, how is it their fault" but what i'm saying is if they did the job wrong then isn't that their responsibility to make up for it?

If its the sensor fine, i'm starting to believe it more and more that its the sensor, but i'm just trying to be sure. I'm not one of those idiots out there saying "OMFG YOU TOUCHED MY BRAKES AND NOW MY TRANS IS DEAD, ITS YOUR FAULT". You guys have to remember I go to engineering school (for Mechanical Engineering), I know exactly what your beef is with those idiots, but i'm not stupid to think that touching something completely unrelated is your fault.

All I'm saying is that if is NOT the sensor, then its them messing up their job, which is my frustration at the moment. All the diagnoses and stuff took place in the last two days.

[BART]

I still don't see how this can possibly be their fault? They did exactly what you or your dad told them to do. If your sensor is fine and you find that your car actually is leaking (whether external or internal), how would that possibly be a fault of theirs?

[Kaze]

I'm saying a Pressurization or Air bubble issue would be their fault, is that not right?

EDIT: Like I understand if there anything else going on in the system, not their fault. But I'm really worried about the pressurization issue cause i looked at the reservoir two nights ago and it was right at the top of the "cooling range" lines on the side of the tank. Now the fluid is about an inch to an inch and a half more in there. Am I wrong, but wouldn't a pressurization issue mean that the coolant isn't making it all the way into the engine or around the system?

[BART]

No. That would be a circulation issue.

[texan_idiot25]

No, pressure is created by heat, that's all it is. Pressure is used to raise the boiling temp as well, which is why you have rated radiator caps for different PSI. The level of coolant in your jug is a result of the liquid expanding and contracting. Your car does this all the time in a modern cooling system. It over flows and draws coolant from the jug during it's heat cycles. Your just now noticing it because you think it's a problem. A pressure leak, aka, a radiator leak would be easy to find. You'd be leaking coolant, or steam from the pressurized parts of the system when the car is hot. Your overflow jug is not apart of the pressurized areas of the cooling system. It's job is to just hold coolant when it expands and then allow the cooling system to suck it back in when it cools.

And air bubbles work themselves out pretty quick when driving. Not only that, but that's a step in refilling the coolant to run the motor until the thermostat opens and the whole coolant system opens up. Any air bubbles work their way to the coolant's highest point, the cap.

Jiffy Lube has nothing to do with this. All they do is open the drain plug, purge the system, and then refill. It's monkey work. I can do it with a garden hose and a drain pan on my truck.

Jimmy's ASE Certified, I'd trust in his words about the sensor...

[BART]

Tex elaborated on what i was trying to say (was typing on my phone). However tex, his car does use a pressurized overflow tank as most modern fords do. This as you said though has nothing to do with his "problem". The sad fact is that jiffy lube probably didnt even do a flush, most likely they topped it off with a hose (do a jiffy lube search on google or youtube, tons of info on them constantly getting busted for this). the most obvious problem is as jimmy stated, the failure prone sensor, or just put some good ole electrical tape over the light

[texan_idiot25]

Originally Posted by BART

Tex elaborated on what i was trying to say (was typing on my phone). However tex, his car does use a pressurized overflow tank as most modern fords do

**** fords and their strange setups. But, I suppose makes sense where it doesn't have a traditional cap that vents the pressure to the jug.

[ling427ttvette]

Originally Posted by texan_idiot25

**** fords and their strange setups. But, I suppose makes sense where it doesn't have a traditional cap that vents the pressure to the jug.

Eh, My Cavalier is the same way. It's got a pressurized overflow tank.

[suicide_star]

I'm old school, as long as it's not running hot and it's got oil...it's good to go in my book =P If the coolant level sensor is bad, i don't see how it would affect the mechanical operation of your car, the only thing it would to is turn the light on. As long as you know that you don't have a coolant leak and you keep an eye on your temp gauge, i wouldn't worry about it.

[ravevolution]

I'm gonna go with the consensus that the issue may not soo much that you had a low fluid hence and did the flush, but the sensor (even if the Ph balance is out on the coolant). But it would be smart to go back to Jlube and have them take a look at it, if your too ticked at them, then take it to a certified mech.

though i do think you overpaid for the coolant flush, (cat is out of the bag) I work for Sears Auto and a coolant flush is typically 69.99, plus furthermore a coolant flush is typically recommended around a 40-50k maint. interval or however the manuf. recommends. Now if you have that kinda of mileage or more and never did one well then good looking out.

and yes Fords are notorious for having little dumb issues like this, really notorious imo for leaks from oil, tranny to coolant. I'd be more ****ed bout that

[Kaze]

Originally Posted by suicide_star

I'm old school, as long as it's not running hot and it's got oil...it's good to go in my book =P If the coolant level sensor is bad, i don't see how it would affect the mechanical operation of your car, the only thing it would to is turn the light on. As long as you know that you don't have a coolant leak and you keep an eye on your temp gauge, i wouldn't worry about it.

heh I've been doing that the last three days at school basically being slightly rough on the car to see the responses and changes, the sensor has only come on 3 times in 4 nights of driving. Usually shutting the car off and turning it back on fixed it. I guess i'll go with the sensor on this one, Everything said here makes sense too, I'm just making sure things work right I need to make sure the car runs fine you know?

Originally Posted by ravevolution

I'm gonna go with the consensus that the issue may not soo much that you had a low fluid hence and did the flush, but the sensor (even if the Ph balance is out on the coolant). But it would be smart to go back to Jlube and have them take a look at it, if your too ticked at them, then take it to a certified mech.

though i do think you overpaid for the coolant flush, (cat is out of the bag) I work for Sears Auto and a coolant flush is typically 69.99, plus furthermore a coolant flush is typically recommended around a 40-50k maint. interval or however the manuf. recommends. Now if you have that kinda of mileage or more and never did one well then good looking out.

and yes Fords are notorious for having little dumb issues like this, really notorious imo for leaks from oil, tranny to coolant. I'd be more ****ed bout that

heh I had my share of tranny leak @50k or so miles, cousin looked at it, opened it to the leak, sealed back up and refilled with fluid (good as new lol) I'm surprisingly getting a slight oil leak thats bugging me, The first night i looked everything was nice and dry, but now theres small grease/motor oil stains traveling down from the oil cap. The stains have been getting bigger during the driving periods

[texan_idiot25]

Put a square of black electrical tape over the light on the dash. Carry extra jugs of coolant in the truck. Drive.

Originally Posted by ling427ttvette

Eh, My Cavalier is the same way. It's got a pressurized overflow tank.

**** modern cars and their ridiculous designs.

[Michael Long]

My dad had a 2006 Volkswagen Passat. It was a nice car with a V4 2.0 Turbocharged engine requiring premium. My dad found the price of premium very expensive cause back then it was around $3.26 per gallon so he put regular into it. After driving 60,000 miles, the car had the same problem. The light would go on and my dad would get a smog check and it goes off. It kept doing so, so my dad sold the car. The VolksWagen dealer did every thing from smog checks to oil changes to replacing fluids, but it was no help at all. Now we drive our old Acura CL again and it has the same problem, but it has 171K miles on it. It says check engine, but we had a oil change, transmission change, tire replacement, tire rotation, and smog check a few months ago and that was only because the car needed all that. So now we put black eletric tape over the check engine thing because it only says nonsense.

[ling427ttvette]

Michael, you realize that running a lower grade of fuel in a car that requires premium causes the car to run horribly, and most likely get worse gas mileage.. in the end causing you to pay more than you need to.

Also, check engine lights don't tell you when you need to do regular maintenance like fluid changes and rotations.. there are SEVERAL reasons that light could be coming on. That's why they add a diagnostic port for a scan tool to be plugged into, to read the computer and find out why the light is on. It could be a small cheap problem, or a big problem.. get the thing checked. The light is there for a reason.

Also, I4. Not V4, V4's have not been produced for decades now.

[texan_idiot25]

engine requiring premium. My dad found the price of premium very expensive cause back then it was around $3.26 per gallon so he put regular into it.

I'm sorry, but your dad [shouldn't be] ignoring all the stickers that say "Premium Only". It requires it for the sake of efficiency, performance, and engine life. So you save maybe a few bucks at the pump, but you get less on a tank for what you just bought. Not to mention your car ran poorly, and you also have the chance of ruining a motor that needs the higher octane gas due to it's compression ratios. And then you send the car to the repair shops, waste money doing nothing because again, you didn't put the right type of gas into it, and then you sell the car because it runs poorly on the gas he decided to put in it.

If the sticker says "PREMIUM ONLY" it does not mean "HEY PUT REGULAR IN HERE ITS HOKAY". Simple instructions lad.

Geez, my truck runs like crap on walmart's regular gas. Must be a problem with the engine, I think I'll rebuild it. Maybe sell it, I dunno what the problem could be. It used to run so good before I put regular gas in it....

See the fallacy?